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Sarah Who?, Take Two:

My earlier posting on Sarah Palin generated some interesting (and pointed) comments, some of which I tried to respond to directly, but I thought that perhaps it called for a more thoughtful response. I think the choice was both bad and (probably) stupid.

Why It's (probably) Stupid. It's probably stupid because it will gain McCain little and may lose him a great deal. Nobody can possibly know, at this point, how she will perform on the stage she is about to enter onto -- debates with 100 million viewers, a daily crush of reporters, speech after speech after speech, where one bad gaffe puts you in the dustbin of history forever. It's unspeakable pressure, she's never faced anything like it, and I'd happily put money on the following: she will make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months. Plus, I don't care how carefully vetted she's been by the McCain campaign -- I think it's close to even money that 10,000 reporters and bloggers who will now descend upon Alaska (at least virtually) will find something less than savory.

Why It's Bad. It's a bad choice because John McCain is 71 years old, and his vice president will have a non-trivial chance of becoming president, and absolutely nothing suggests that Sarah Palin would be credible as President of the United States. I do NOT think this is just a matter of adding up the number of years spent doing this or doing that. Sarah Palin has been in public life, basically, for two years. to my knowledge, she has never articulated (because she was never called upon to articulate) any views whatsoever on:

military strategy in the Persian Gulf
the proper response to Iranian nuclear weapons
the Russian invasion of Georgia
the United Nations
US immigration policy
the Federal Reserve Bank
the effectiveness of international aid programs
Israeli-Palestinian relations
AIDS policy
federal support for basic research
European Union integration
the US Constitution
the optimal means of protecting US borders from terrorists
Guantanamo, and the proper scope of interrogation techniques
Deficit financing and Keynesian economics
the Supreme Court

Should I go on? I could, of course. But hopefully you get the idea. How anyone could say that knowing what they know now they'd be comfortable with her as President is entirely beyond me.

FantasiaWHT:
Are presidential (and vice-presidential) candidates becoming like judicial nominees, where the ones least likely to crash and burn are the ones who DON'T have long histories of stances to go on?
8.29.2008 6:47pm
Shertaugh:
David:

A small nit. Today was McCain's birthday. He's now 72, not 71.
8.29.2008 6:52pm
Constantin:
David, Obama probably will be the president in about 100 days. I'll bet you couldn't tell me what his precise positions are on more than a few of those issues you list. Nobody has any idea what the guy's actual tax policy will be, for crying at loud.

As I posed below: as someone who doesn't want to see Obama in the White House, I hope everyone keeps the focus on everyone's relative experience for as long as possible.
8.29.2008 6:54pm
Nunzio:
David,

All great points, but she's not being judged in the abstract, she's being judged against Obama. (I guess you could say she's being judged against Biden, but since we're talking about if she's actually President-ready Obama is the comparison).

And she's being judged by voters who are not as smart as you and resent people who think they're so smart. Neither Kennedy, Reagan, Truman or W. were that bright. Nixon and Clinton are very smart. Obama, McCain, Gore, Kerry and H.W. Bush are all smart enough but not as smart as Nixon and Clinton.

And as far as the categories of issues you listed, people far smarter than Nixon and Clinton disagree and continue to disagree on each of those issues.

Again, W. was elected POTUS twice. Do you think, even after the last 8 years, he could articulate a thoughtful response to more than 3 of those issues?
8.29.2008 6:57pm
Ohismith (mail):
Constantin 5:54--the only ones who don't know Obama's tax policy by now are the ones who are willfully ignorant.
David: Palin is the choice because the Republicans want to drown gov't in the bathtub, and having an incompetent v.p. who lives in Alaska is one more step in that direction. You know she will continue to live with her family in Alaska, right?
8.29.2008 7:02pm
Anderson (mail):
Nobody has any idea what the guy's actual tax policy will be, for crying at loud.

Um, because it's going to be wildly different than what he says it will be?

And she's being judged by voters who are not as smart as you

Well, that's exactly it. Shocker tho it be to we blog-commenting types, millions of people will vote this November 4 who don't actually know or care anything about politics.

Some of those people will probably vote McCain b/c Palin's on the ticket. In a close election, hey, that could be enough. Look for Palin to pretty much *live* in Ohio for the next two months.
8.29.2008 7:04pm
EH (mail):
Constantin:
As I posed below: as someone who doesn't want to see Obama in the White House, I hope everyone keeps the focus on everyone's relative experience for as long as possible.


How exactly do you plan to square the reality of your inevitable Obama administration with an imaginary set of criteria based on "what could have been?" I mean, if the above is to somehow reserve a right to complain in the future, my only response is "Welcome to the Internet!"

As a gesture of good will, maybe at this late date we can endeavor to arrive at some fixed definition of "experience," since the definition seems to shift on a weekly or daily basis. How are you defining it in the snippet excerpted above? Do either of us even have a role in defining "experience" for ourselves in this context?
8.29.2008 7:05pm
Anderson (mail):
Crossed w/ Ohismith ... she's gotta campaign, man.

People in Ohio are probably conditioned by now, they won't vote for any candidate who didn't personally give them a cookie.
8.29.2008 7:05pm
BarrySanders20:
Yes, much better to have another Senator on the ticket, so we have all four spots filled with such experience. More Washington insiders = more experience = the government we know and love.

C'mon man, have the audacity to hope for changiness! Or are you one of those hopeless clinging white males who are stuck in the past?
8.29.2008 7:06pm
Houston Lawyer:
Most conservatives agree with each other on most things and liberals generally agree with each other. It is not possible for the vast majority of voters to vote based upon a detailed analysis of every position of the candidates. They will go with someone with whom they are comfortable.

It doesn't take that many data points to determine whether you are generally of the same mind with someone. Most people will quickly make up their minds about Palin based upon a brief review of her disposition. To expect more is not rational.
8.29.2008 7:07pm
Le Messurier (mail):

views whatsoever on:

military strategy in the Persian Gulf
the proper response to Iranian nuclear weapons
the Russian invasion of Georgia
the United Nations
US immigration policy
the Federal Reserve Bank
the effectiveness of international aid programs
Israeli-Palestinian relations
AIDS policy
federal support for basic research
European Union integration
the US Constitution
the optimal means of protecting US borders from terrorists
Guantanamo, and the proper scope of interrogation techniques
Deficit financing and Keynesian economics
the Supreme Court


Gee, I can express thoughtful responses to all but two of those items listed and I'm not even a lawyer! Of course if I were a lawyer I'd be able to express responses on all of them and even more. I'd have definitive responses on everything!
8.29.2008 7:07pm
Anderson (mail):
some fixed definition of "experience,"

I shall rise to the challenge:

EXPERIENCE (n.) -- Practical contact with facts and events that leads a candidate to agree with my ideology.

(H/t to Oxford American Dictionary.)
8.29.2008 7:08pm
voter:
I remember when JFK nominated RFK to be AG. Said he (RFK) needed some experience.
8.29.2008 7:09pm
armchairpunter:
If it is going to take a marketing ploy to secure the White House, this may be one of the less bad options. It suckers the Dems into talking about experience. It plays to the frontiersman/woman iconography that still resonates with a large part of our populace, not least, with a large portion of the WalMart customer base. (This is especially so when placed alongside effete ivy league types.)

We'll see how the VP candidate performs as a speaker and debater, but initial indications are not bad at all. (Who do you think is more concerned about the VP debate, Palin or Biden?)
8.29.2008 7:13pm
Constantin:
From Ohismith:

Constantin 5:54--the only ones who don't know Obama's tax policy by now are the ones who are willfully ignorant.

I guess that includes the Associated Press, as of this morning:

"He said he would 'cut taxes for 95 percent of all working families,' but did not say how."

Link
8.29.2008 7:13pm
Brett:
This post is as content-free as the last one, and both are functionally indistinguishable from an Obama campaign talking point.
8.29.2008 7:14pm
Shawn Levasseur (mail) (www):
"I'd happily put money on the following: she will make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months."

That'll be a safe bet for any VP nominee. It goes with the job.
8.29.2008 7:14pm
Jonathan H. Adler (mail) (www):
David --

Your arguments would be more convincing if your characterization of Palin's career was more accurate and complete. She's expressed opinions on a handful of the issues you mention, but few governors talk about such things before they run for national office, and she's been involved in serious hardball politics for more than two years. Before she was governor, and after she served on city council and as mayor of an admittedly small town, she was chair of the Alaska Conservation Commission and President of the Alaska Conference of Mayors. I also think taking out the corrupt Alaska GOP political machine is not the sort of accomplishment to be taken lightly. She might not have as much experience as you would like, but she has far more than you're giving her credit for.

JHA
8.29.2008 7:17pm
transfer student (mail):
If she adopts her party's position on all these issues, as most candidates do, would you be comfortable? She's at the bottom of the ticket anyway, so her job is to have McCain's views, not her own. See, e.g., Joe Lieberman in 2000, who adopted Al Gore's positions and threw over his own (which was itself only that small number of issues in which Lieberman disagreed with his party).

Why would we think that reporters will want to go to Alaska to find something? Reporters haven't been interested in Obama's Chicago political career. What's different about this person?
8.29.2008 7:19pm
Lyle (mail):
I guess only Ivy Leaguers can ever be in the White House.

Knowing jackshit about European integration is the least any President of United States needs to know about.

Being from Alaska, I bet she knows a a thing or two about Russia. I mean, if Putin were to ever make a judo move on her, I'm sure she'll just shoot him dead.
8.29.2008 7:20pm
rarango (mail):
David David David--I appreciate and genuinely share your concern for issues. I hate to do this to you, but presidential elections are not about issues--they are about image and marketing--now if you could tell me what Obama's positions are on those issues I will be eternally grateful; and we don't know what Palin's views on those issues because they arent the ones that governors normally deal with--its the old federalism thing. Now, why don't we ask Gov Palin and find out.
8.29.2008 7:22pm
The Ace (mail):
Um, because it's going to be wildly different than what he says it will be?

Considering he back tracked on it, why yes it certainly could be.
8.29.2008 7:29pm
jgshapiro (mail):
I think the pick is brilliant.

True, in the immediate aftermath of the announcement, Obama can say "gotcha" to McCain for campaigning so far on experience and then picking Palin just as McCain said "gotcha" for campaigning so far on change and then picking Biden.

But this is just inside baseball. Obama cannot focus on Palin's inexperience without highlighting that on the other ticket, it is him -- the top guy -- with no experience. Who would you rather vote for, a president with little experience or a VP with little experience? If experience is what you care about the choice is still clear.

Beyond that:

It highlights the maverick angle by highlighting that McCain is not a predictable Republican, but will buck conventional wisdom. That matters to people looking for change.

It highlights that McCain is a reformer, not another Bush partisan, by picking someone who doubles down on the reform angle and who has made a career out of fighting partisanship and her own party's corruption. Palin is effectively the (younger female) McCain of Alaska. This will energize moderates and independents as well as conservatives tired of Tom Delay-style politics.

It energizes conservatives because Palin is living the right-to-life mantra, not just preaching it.

It takes away the history angle of Obama by ensuring that whomever is elected, history is made.

It takes away the focus on Obama's speech of last night, which will suppress his convention bounce.

It takes away Biden's ability to beat up on the VP pick in the VP debate because Biden will look like an a-hole to many people if he does that to a woman. And Biden now has to watch himself on the patronizing claim. So it may turn out to neutralize one of the main advantages of Biden by neutering Biden in the debate. Time will tell.

This is the best Democratic year since 1976. Any "safe" pick would have ceded the election to Obama. It is Obama's election to lose. Probably no other pick would have generated this much excitement from both moderates and conservatives.

McCain needed a game-changer, and he just got one. She may or may not provide enough lift for him in November, but she is the best he could do under the circumstances.
8.29.2008 7:29pm
Thomas_Holsinger:
McCain chose Palin for the same reason Obama chose Biden - to help him get elected, and target the same relative audience, i.e., both choices were made to shore up the nominees with their respective party bases. IMO Biden will do it as a not-uncommon attack dog compared to Obama's "Mr. Nice Guy", while Palin has wowed the GOP base with her positions on issues.

What probably made her McCain's choice is that her sunny temperment will complement McCain's crankiness.

Think of it this way: the top nominees are Young &Optimistic versus Old &Cranky, so McCain desperately needs a running mate who is Young &Sunny.

I personally would much, much rather have Palin as President than Joe Biden. Steady Biden ain't - he makes McCain seem calm, sweet, reason. Palin showed she is tough enough by taking on and beating a corrupt machine when she was elected Governor of Alaska. That's how Fred Thompson made his chops in Tennessee.
8.29.2008 7:30pm
The Ace (mail):
Again, W. was elected POTUS twice. Do you think, even after the last 8 years, he could articulate a thoughtful response to more than 3 of those issues?

Hilarious.

We know you could not.
8.29.2008 7:31pm
twwren:
I agree; those are the reasons I too am uncomfortable with Obama. Oh, wait. You were talking about Palin.
Never mind.
8.29.2008 7:33pm
Dan Bongard:
Neither Kennedy, Reagan, Truman or W. were that bright. Nixon and Clinton are very smart. Obama, McCain, Gore, Kerry and H.W. Bush are all smart enough but not as smart as Nixon and Clinton.

W did better, both academically and on standardized intelligence tests, than either Gore or Kerry. Other than that, you're basically correct.
8.29.2008 7:33pm
mhcoffin (mail):
Far from stupid, I think McCain's choice was brilliant. Drop over to The Corner to see why. Her choice has really fired up the Republican conservative base, which up until now was barely tolerating McCain. And, unlike other candidates that might have appealed to hardcore conservatives, she isn't going to scare off moderates. Quite the opposite, she might well attract a fair number of moderate women.
8.29.2008 7:33pm
Nunzio:
As far as Obama's tax policy, if he wants to raise revenue without raising tax rates, while still appealing to the working class, he should just get rid of the itemized deductions. Only 28% of individual filers itemize deductions (while more than 2/3 of Americans own a home).

He could at least phase them out, starting with the charitable deduction itemization (he could also disallow this as a deduction for corporations as well). Why should rich people get to deduct donations to their alma maters, churches, pet charities, etc. The working man doesn't get to do this and still gives to his church and to other good causes.
8.29.2008 7:33pm
Pete Freans (mail):
And we are to trust a man who spent a total of 143 working days in the U.S. Senate before announcing his candidacy for president with arguably the most powerful political seat in the world? It is clear from Mr. Post's arguments that he was blindsided by this choice as many of Obama-ites were.
8.29.2008 7:37pm
The Ace (mail):
I love the fact that Obama voters are suggesting that Palin isn't qualified.

This is hysterical to watch.
8.29.2008 7:37pm
Norman Bates (mail):
Why she's a good choice:
(1) Her newsworthiness takes the spotlight from the Dems just when they thought they had a lock on it. It also probably gives McCain a lot of the "bounce" that Obama thought he'd automatically get.
(2) It solidifies McCains religious/social conservative base. This woman doesn't just talk the talk, she walkjs the walk: She and her husband plan to raise their new infant son, who has Down's Syndrome, just like their other four children. No convenient abortions for this lady.
(3) At the same time it grabs a big chunk of women voters who wanted Hillary and will be happy with this woman. Unlike Hillary McCain's VP is the real thing. She's raised a family, has a husband who works on the North Slope, and went into politics to clean up the corruption in Alaska.
(4) She may appeal to young voters: She's younger than McCain and Biden. She can't be much older than Obama. Unlike Obama she's a real reformer who fought the political machine in her state insterad of becoming part of it.
(5) She's photogenic and articulate. Check her out on You Tube. Did I mention she was an ex beauty queen?
(6) She's got enough experience to take on the Republican machine in Alaska and win three times, clean up an important but corrupt state agency, and beat an incumbent governor. In my book, that puts her way ahead of Obama, who basically got where he is the same way the "Master of the Queen's Navy" did in HMS Pinafore, i.e., by toeing the party line and never thinking for himself at all.

And did I mention that she's a real conservative.
8.29.2008 7:39pm
Railroad Gin:
I don't know what Palin's position on foreign policy is but its a safe bet that she's better than Obama's talk with our enemies approach or Biden's plan of endless prattling with state department bureaucrats and Ivy League academics.

Someone who is pro-life, pro-2A, pro drilling in ANWR, prefers hockey over soccer, hunts moose, was a commercial fisherman, and ran the "bridge to nowhere" crowd out of town is in all probability going to have foreign policy views that jibe with mainstream conservatives. Its possible I'm wrong, but one would think McCain talked about this when he interviewed/vetted her. And I don't think there's any doubt that she thinks Scalia is better judge than Ginsburg.

Immigration, however, is an area where conservatives might have some cause to worry given McCain's shakiness on this. My guess is we'll get the usual pablum about being for legal immigration and against illegal immigration.

Will all due respect, some of these items border on the trivial. The average American probably cares more about what the candidates think about Brett Favre trade than his or her stance on AIDS policy.

If anything, Obama has less experience. I'd like to say that the aikido blowback effect of democrats raising this was half the rationale of picking Palin, but that's giving McCain too much credit.
8.29.2008 7:41pm
The Ace (mail):
How anyone could say that knowing what they know now they'd be comfortable with her as President is entirely beyond me.

Laugh out loud funny.

Thank you for such rank and idiotic hypocrisy.

By the way, I'd love for you or any other Obama voter to explain his actual position on the 2nd Amendment.

Funny nobody can say given he is a "constitutional law" lecturer and all.

Finally, remember that meme on the part of the left about Bush enlisting his kids in the military?

Where did that go again?

McCain's son is in Iraq and his youngest is at West Point.
Palin's son enlisted and is going.

Obama, who has never served, wants to invade Pakistan.
8.29.2008 7:41pm
kevin r (mail):
(4) She may appeal to young voters: She's younger than McCain and Biden. She can't be much older than Obama. Unlike Obama she's a real reformer who fought the political machine in her state insterad of becoming part of it.


She's a couple years younger than Obama.
8.29.2008 7:43pm
The Ace (mail):
AIDS policy

Gee, that's real complicated and all.
8.29.2008 7:44pm
Jiffy:
jgshapiro:


Obama cannot focus on Palin's inexperience without highlighting that on the other ticket, it is him -- the top guy -- with no experience. Who would you rather vote for, a president with little experience or a VP with little experience? If experience is what you care about the choice is still clear.


This has it backwards. Obama doesn't have to focus on Palin's anything. People vote for presidential candidates, not Vice Presidential candidates, and Obama doesn't need to go out of his way to attack Palin.

On the other hand, the choice of Palin now prevents McCain and the Republicans from pressing their strongest argument--Obama's supposed inexperience and lack of readiness to be President. McCain is not going to win on the issues, and raising uncertainty about Obama's ability to be Commander in Chief has always been his best shot.

This choice was a terrible stragegic blunder.
8.29.2008 7:47pm
The Ace (mail):
the choice of Palin now prevents McCain and the Republicans from pressing their strongest argument--Obama's supposed inexperience and lack of readiness to be President.

Keep dreaming.

McCain is not going to win on the issues,

Obama is not going to win on the issues.

Isn't this fun?
8.29.2008 7:52pm
Trevor Taylor (mail):
The writer of this article really needs to step back and think for a second. Every single thing he lists as a potential negative against Palin is a definite negative against Obama. With one major difference, he's on the top of the ticket while she's on the bottom. Two years as governor plus time served as Mayor is more executive experience than Obama has, so if she's not qualified what does that make him?
8.29.2008 7:54pm
metro_k_attys@yahoo.com (mail) (www):
Barack Obama has zero executive experience.

Joe Biden has zero executive experience.

John McCain has military command experience.

Sarah Palin has executive experience as Governor of the largest state in the Union - and as Mayor of the fastest-growing town in Alaska. (Personally, I like small-town America).

On the experience issue, McCain and Palin win.

Besides, the "foreign policy experience" argument is non-serious. What was the "foreign policy experience" of Ronald Reagan, Franklin Roosevelt or Margaret Thatcher?

A great President is a great leader. Leadership skills are most clearly seen in people who have actually led: like McCain and Palin.

The "foreign policy experience" argument is actually a negative to me. I'd rather have someone with clear leadership skills as an American chief executive (like Governor Palin) - or military command experience (like McCain) - not someone who sat on some foreign affairs committee in Congress (like Biden).

Also - Palin's approval ratings in Alaska have consistently been over 80%! She's a leader. So is McCain. Obama and Biden are legislators - they've never held an executive or command position in their lives.

On experience McCain and Palin win.
8.29.2008 7:54pm
byomtov (mail):
ran the "bridge to nowhere" crowd out of town

You guys believe anything the RNC says.


5. Would you continue state funding for the proposed Knik Arm and Gravina Island bridges?

Yes. I would like to see Alaska's infrastructure projects built sooner rather than later. The window is now--while our congressional delegation is in a strong position to assist.
8.29.2008 7:56pm
Nunzio:
The Ace: McCain's son is at Annapolis, not West Point.
8.29.2008 7:57pm
A.W. (mail):
Sheesh, the woman has more executive branch experience than McCain, Obama, and Biden combined...

If she isn't ready to be president, none of them are. Especially not Obama.

And I don't see how lack of experience is fatal to her, when she only might be president if you pull the Republican lever, but Obama's lack of experience is no big deal, even though he will definitely be president if you pull the Dem lever.

As for all those issues, do we know where obama stands on any of those?
8.29.2008 7:58pm
Andrew J. Lazarus (mail):
As mayor, Palin had one-fourth as many constituents as the head of the UC Berkeley Student Senate. Can we stop pretending that's significant experience?

Governor counts for something, but I would point out that Alaska has a small population and its economy, based on resource extraction, does not extrapolate to the USA as a whole. For the tasks Palin would face if she became President, she is completely untested. Whether that makes her unqualified is a judgment we all have to make separately.
8.29.2008 7:58pm
James Gibson (mail):
Mr. Posts problem is the same problem as Al Rantel, judging Palin independently of the present alternatives. Though its true she would be within splitting distance of the presidency if anything went wrong, but the alternative now is giving the presidency to someone just as inexperienced right off the bat. That is unless both Mr. Post and Mr. Rantel expect Obama to die in office, as they seem to expect McCain to do, and thus place the presidency in the experienced hands of Joe Biden.

Another fact that seems to be lost on anyone, VPs who are elevated to the office of president are not expected to create their own policies and programs. The general view is VPs inherit the presidents foreign and domestic policies and continue them until the next election cycle. Thus, if Sarah Palin does have to take the reins after say three years she will do little to change the cabinet, secretaries or other Presidential appointees, and probably couldn't get a Supreme Court justice appointed.

But the flip side is Obama on January 1st 2009 will begin making his political appointments, setting the foreign and domestic policy for the next four years and everything else a full president is authorised to do by the Constitution. And even if something was to happen to him would Biden change these policies on Elevation to VP or continue the policies as previous VPs have (Teddy Roosevelt being the obvious exception).

Given this, I'll take the risk of Palin over four assured years of Obama. Besides, if McCain makes it through four years but becomes too old to run for a second term the Party will then designate the candidate for 2012. The sitting VP doesn't always get the nod.
8.29.2008 7:59pm
Waldensian (mail):
Well, we do know that she wants to teach Creationism in public schools.
8.29.2008 8:00pm
rarango (mail):
and BTW: are either Obama or Biden members of a union? Palin knows how to handle a gun and hold a salmon--dont have to generate photo ops trying to goose hunt. This resonates with those gun grabbing folks who cling to religion--it was a pick to grab the base and fire them up and as was suggested above peel off some hillary supporters. Great choice tactically.
But also a great choice strategically (and I give mccain no credit here)--he has put palin into the front runner position in 2012 and its a great new republican face--how about a Palin Jindal ticket in 2012? The democrats talk the diversity crap; this moves the republicans into a major advantage in 2012
8.29.2008 8:01pm
rarango (mail):
Oh, and David--I agree that VP candidates dont influence the outcome much--but you are assuming that VPs cant rise to meet the occasion--tell that to Harry Truman.
8.29.2008 8:03pm
The Ace (mail):
Obama doesn't have to focus on Palin's anything.

You must have missed this:

"Today, John McCain put the former mayor of a town of 9,000 with zero foreign policy experience a heartbeat away from the presidency."


the choice of Palin now prevents McCain and the Republicans from pressing their strongest argument--Obama's supposed inexperience and lack of readiness to be President.

Er, good luck with that.



Asked to address Mr Obama directly, the voters said: "How are you going to get it done?"; "Prove you have experience."; "How will you fix things?"; "Stop the dramatic talk, we want reality."; "Focus on issues, not personality."; "Don't just give me an empty balloon."

Most of the undecided voters said they wanted "accountability" rather than change. From a long list of election concerns, 17 highlighted a top theme of Mr McCain's: "Ending wasteful Washington spending and balancing the federal budget."


By the way, I guess this is the change we can believe in!


Biden has described himself as a 30-year friend of a key figure in the Rezko trial who's pleaded guilty to a federal extortion charge in Chicago and is awaiting sentencing.

When the Delaware senator began contemplating his own 2008 presidential run, he initially was helped by Chicago lawyer Joseph Cari Jr., who also served as Biden's Midwest field director in his failed 1988 bid for president.

In 2005, Cari admitted to taking part in an $850,000 kickback scheme that prosecutors say was part of a larger political fund-raising operation for Gov. Blagojevich overseen by Rezko, who was convicted in June of wide-ranging corruption involving state deals.


What I find most funny is that Obama completely undercut the "change" meme by picking Senator Amtrak and you people said nary a peep.
8.29.2008 8:04pm
Nibbles:

...where one bad gaffe puts you in the dustbin of history forever.


So, how did Biden get to be where he is?
8.29.2008 8:04pm
Just Dropping By (mail):
I find it funny that so many folks are announcing what a great "family values" candidate Palin is based on having a large family when, if Obama had nominated a woman with a four month-old baby (with Down's Syndrome to boot), those same individuals would be shrieking that she was a selfish bitch who was abandoning her child to go jetting off around the country.
8.29.2008 8:06pm
YYY:
David-

Palin has been both a mayor and a governor. She is more quailfied for leadership as POTUS, even as a VP, then Obamanation.

I can already see Palin vs Hillary in 2012.
8.29.2008 8:06pm
The Ace (mail):
The Ace: McCain's son is at Annapolis, not West Point.

Sorry.

Obama is still a chickenhawk.
8.29.2008 8:06pm
Jiffy:
The Ace:


McCain is not going to win on the issues,

Obama is not going to win on the issues.

Isn't this fun?



My statement was based on polling that consistently shows that this year the electorate is more aligned with Democratic issue positions, has more faith in the Democrats to deal with most problems and is trending heavily Democratic. And yours is based on what, exactly?
8.29.2008 8:09pm
Smokey:
I'm used to articles from VC bloggers taking a middle of the road approach. They may veer a little to one side or another, but generally they write their articles, and then let the commenters take the pro and con sides and hash things out.

But David Post sounds like a refugee from the DailyKos or the DU. Unlike the other bloggers, Post is a blatant Obama propagandist, pure and simple. His partisanship is so thick you could cut it with a knife. it takes a real nitwit to begin hating Sarah Palin, starting only on the day she's named as a running mate.
8.29.2008 8:11pm
astrangerwithcandy (mail):
your argument still doesn't make sense..


Sarah Palin has been in public life, basically, for two years. to my knowledge, she has never articulated (because she was never called upon to articulate) any views whatsoever on:


so, if she spent a year articulating her views she would be ok in your view? thats the only thing that separates Obama at the start of this campaign from your critique quoted.
you are a professor of law and clerked?
8.29.2008 8:13pm
MarkField (mail):

W did better, both academically and on standardized intelligence tests, than either Gore or Kerry.


This is wrong. W's SAT scores (1206) were lower than Gore's (1355).
8.29.2008 8:19pm
Pizza Snob:
As Bill Clinton correctly noted, no one really has the experience to be President when they become President. The office holder will have the best and brightest advisers that can be had, and will almost certainly toe the line on a party platform that's been well established in advance.

All that matters in a candidate, then, is their good judgment and strength of character, the qualities they'll need to rely on when decisions need to be made.

That's why McCain's POW stint and Palin's disabled child mean more in this election than Obama's health care plan or Biden's foreign policy know-how. You can hire the latter, but not the former. Palin's a good addition to the ticket.
8.29.2008 8:24pm
Rick Rockwell:
I think it's an acknowledgment by McCain that respectable and dull (Dole/Kemp) won't cut it against a charismatic opponent. Palin gives him an x-factor, for better or worse.

Although I wish about everyone on both tickets were a different age-I'd like to see the McCain of 2000 and Obama and Palin with some terms under their belt.
8.29.2008 8:46pm
Justin (mail):
Pizza snob, I don't think it's LEGAL to hire a disabled child.

How does having a six month disabled child show character? I've met people who have disabled children who are horrible people.
8.29.2008 8:46pm
NYU JD:
For me, the key indicator that anti-Palin types should look at is this:

From the Saddleback Forum:

Warren: What's the most significant -- let me ask it this way: what's the most gut wrenching decision you've ever had to make and how did you process that, come to that decsion?

Obama: Well, you know, I think the opposition to the war in Iraq was as tough a decision that I've had to make not only because there were political consequences but also because Saddam Hussein was a bad person and there was no doubt that he meant America Ill, but I was firmly convinced at the time that we did not have strong evidence of weapons of mass destruction and there were a lot of questions that as I spoke to experts kept on coming up, do we know how the Shiites and the Sunnis and the Kurds are going to get along in a post-Saddam situation, what's our assessment as to how this will affect the battle against terrorists like Al-Qaeda, have we finished the job in Afghanistan, so I agonized over that and I think questions of war and peace generally are so profound, you know, when you meet the troops, they are 19, 20, 21 year old kids and you are putting them into harm's way, there is a solemn obligation that you do everything you can to get that decision right.


Note that Obama's "decision to oppose the war" was irrelevant; he wasn't even a federal senator at the time, but a state senator with no responsibility for foreign policy whatsoever.

From a Newsweek interview with Palin back in May:

Karen Breslau: I wonder if you could just take a moment to talk about the toughest decision you have to make...

Sarah Palin: We deal with reality and legalities every day. A recent decision--it put me again on the outs with the Republican Party up there--recognizing, and I go back to industry and resource development here, but recognizing that there were environmental standards that were not as high as they should be with some of our resource development projects up on the North Slope; having to sue the oil companies to make sure that they were adhering to law, and, then, the criticism coming back, saying, "You're going to drive industry out of this state; you're going to create huge unemployment in this state." And, knowing that that was rhetoric--that was not going to be the result, but certainly people had something to hold on to to criticize, saying, "You're going to sue industry that provides 85% of our state's budget, and send this message that we're not actually partners with industry." But I'm looking long term, looking at my kids growing up, wanting to provide them opportunities, wanting to them to realize clean air, clean water, healthy wildlife up there in Alaska. We got to make sure that we're taking care of that today, which means we've got to make sure that our producers of our oil and our gas are following the law, in fact, we have to beef up and strengthen our environmental laws up in Alaska, so that we can prove that we have the correct oversight to allow this development to happen, so recently, suing Exxon, suing BP, suing Coneco-Phillips--


And Obama's more qualified? Obama's had tougher decisions to make?
8.29.2008 8:49pm
The Ace (mail):
My statement was based on polling that consistently shows that this year the electorate is more aligned with Democratic issue positions, has more faith in the Democrats to deal with most problems and is trending heavily Democratic.

Laugh out loud funny.

McCain now has a 9-point edge, 49 percent to 40 percent, over Obama on the critical question of who would be the best manager of the economy -- an issue nearly half of voters said was their top concern in the November 4 presidential election.


And again,

From a long list of election concerns, 17 highlighted a top theme of Mr McCain's: "Ending wasteful Washington spending and balancing the federal budget."
8.29.2008 8:52pm
Not Danny Darwin:
Zogby? Are you serious? Zogby. Wacka wacka. Where's the Uncle Fred's BBQ poll?
8.29.2008 9:01pm
nicestrategy (mail):

What I find most funny is that Obama completely undercut the "change" meme by picking Senator Amtrak and you people said nary a peep.


Uh, the change meme is change from Republican rule to something other than Republican rule.

Running a Presidential campaign with hundreds of staff and thousands of volunteers that defeated the Clinton machine in a 50 State contest, raising several hundred million dollars in the process while building a grassroots political network is far more relevant executive experience than being mayor of a small town.
8.29.2008 9:08pm
loki13 (mail):
Ace,

Please, stop it. You keep putting links up that either don't support what you say or, as in this instance, you give a wildly misleading take on what the link says. I am getting real tired of calling you on this.

The article was dated Aug. 20th, from data before that date. That poll also gave McCain a significant (beyong MoE) lead in the overall race. To show you how that has changed, (and to give you a perspective, see this.

As of Aug. 26th, voters trusted Obama more than McCain (by only a slight amount) on the economy and energy. See this.

Not that facts have ever seemed to stop many people here.
8.29.2008 9:08pm
metro_k_attys@yahoo.com (mail) (www):
Sarah Palin runs a State. Barack Obama runs his mouth.
8.29.2008 9:12pm
James Lindgren (mail):
David:

What makes you think that Palin hasn't considered any of these? I'll bet she has expressed positions on several. I searched for immigration and Palin and came up with several stories, including this one, which actually covered another topic: protecting borders from terrorists.

Western governors gather to talk agriculture, global energy
CHET BROKAW
Associated Press Writer

PIERRE, S.D._Governors from 10 western states and premiers from two Canadian provinces plan to gather in the historic northern Black Hills gambling town of Deadwood to talk about agricultural policy, global warming and border security.

Members of the Western Governors' Association are particularly eager to discuss the 2007 Farm Bill with U.S. Agriculture Secretary Mike Johanns, who was a member of the group when he was governor of Nebraska, said the association's chairman, Gov. Mike Rounds of South Dakota.

"Most of us know Mike personally," Rounds said. "We're just very fortunate he can come on out and give us some insight on what he sees going on with the 2007 Farm Bill and some of the other issues the western governors will express to him."

The Western Governors' Association annual meeting begins Sunday with a discussion of renewable energy projects and efforts to reduce carbon emissions into the atmosphere. Johanns talks about agriculture issues on Monday, and the meeting ends Tuesday with a discussion on how to cope with climate change.

The annual meeting gives governors from the 19-state region a chance to develop positions aimed at influencing national policies on important issues, Rounds said.

Congress seems to be accepting much of what Johanns proposed in the Farm Bill, Rounds said. That measure deals not only with production of food and fiber, but also with the growth of corn and other crops for ethanol and other renewable energy, he said.

The South Dakota governor said he is interested in programs that promote conservation. Those programs are important for providing wildlife habitat in states where hunting is a big part of the economy, and grasses could eventually be used in ethanol production, he said.

"We also want to talk about things such as drought and flood and how much of the Farm Bill should be used to respond to emergency needs and how much of should be related to energy policy," Rounds said.

Discussions will include new technology for producing energy and reducing pollution, he said.

"Most of us would agree that the climate is changing. Now the question is what do we do to slow down these changes, and second of all, how do we transition our economies to be able to respond to the climate changes that are occurring," the South Dakota governor said. "How does government respond with its programs to the possibilities of significant and more drastic drought conditions and significant weather patterns that might be changing?"

One topic will be carbon sequestration, which includes removing more carbon dioxide from power plant emissions and using plants to remove more carbon dioxide from the air.

Manitoba Premier Gary Doer and Saskatchewan Premier Lorne Calvert will talk with the governors and Stewart A. Baker, assistant secretary of the U.S. Homeland Security Department, about immigration and international travel.

The Canadian premiers would like to establish secure North American borders that prevent terrorists from entering the continent without imposing big barriers to travel between the United States and Canada, Rounds said.

"They don't want to see significant restrictions that could harm our economies here for tourism and so forth," Rounds said.

Expected to attend are Rounds, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano, Colorado Gov. Bill Ritter, Montana Gov. Brian Schweitzer, Nebraska Gov. Dave Heineman, Nevada Gov. Jim Gibbons, North Dakota Gov. John Hoeven, Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman and Wyoming Gov. Dave Freudenthal.
8.29.2008 9:13pm
Norman Bates (mail):
Feigned moral outrage (or perhaps real outrage without a moral basis) is the final refuge of the left wing of the Democrat party when they know they're losing badly. By the feigned moral outrage I saw tonight among the McLaughlin Group's lefties, on various lefty blog posts, and as expressed here by Mr. Post, I'm guessing that the Obamamaniacs in this country are just beginning to realize how badly they've been snookered by McCain's VP choice. After she has four more years of experience under her belt I'm looking forward to voting the Palin/Jindal ticket in 2012
8.29.2008 9:13pm
The Ace (mail):
You keep putting links up that either don't support what you say or, as in this instance, you give a wildly misleading take on what the link says

Hilarious!

You go on to say:
As of Aug. 26th, voters trusted Obama more than McCain (by only a slight amount) on the economy

Um, from your link



McCain-Obama: Trust on Issues
Economy


McCain 48%


Obama 42%


Parody much?
8.29.2008 9:16pm
Angus:
What I find hilarious are the Rush-bots who cut and paste "More executive experience than Obama or Biden."

If they were honest with themselves, they'd admit that Palin is not ready to become President if she had to. I'm confident that McCain doesn't think she's ready. This decision was purely about Nov. 4, not Nov. 5 and beyond.

And from what I can tell, almost all of the enthusiasm for Palin on conservative sites is over her looks, not her competence or experience. Internet nerd crushes do not good Presidents make.
8.29.2008 9:17pm
The Ace (mail):
Please, stop it. You keep putting links up that either don't support what you say

Except you can't demonstrate this.

Further, I put up a link to a focus group of independent voters saying their top issue was in line with McCain's.

Now go ahead and dispute that by posting another link to a poll supporting what I said, clown.
8.29.2008 9:18pm
The Ace (mail):
Uh, the change meme is change from Republican rule to something other than Republican rule.

Laugh out loud funny.

How then, do you explain this?




"I am in this race to tell the corporate lobbyists that their days of setting the agenda in Washington are over. I have done more than any other candidate in this race to take on lobbyists — and won. They have not funded my campaign, they will not run my White House, and they will not drown out the voices of the American people when I am president."

Barack Obama, Speech in Des Moines, IA, November 10, 2007


Don't worry, you don't have an answer. You're too busy deluding yourself.

I did enjoy this, however:

Sen. Barack Obama sought more than $3.4 million in congressional earmarks for clients of the lobbyist son of his Democratic running mate, Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. of Delaware, records show. Obama succeeded in getting $192,000 for one of the clients, St. Xavier University in suburban Chicago.

Obama's campaign has taken a hard stance against the world of lobbying in the nation's capital. Obama said he limits his own efforts to get money for pet projects -- a process known as earmarking -- to those that benefit the public. He has posted his earmark requests on his presidential campaign Web site to encourage transparency.

Since Obama announced his selection of Biden on Saturday, attention has focused on Biden's lobbying connections as well as his son's lobbying activities. R. Hunter Biden is one of many relatives of members of Congress who work as lobbyists.

The younger Biden started his career as a lobbyist in 2001 and has registered to represent about 21 clients that have brought in $3.5 million to his Washington firm, according to lobbying disclosure forms.


Go ahead and return to your delusions now.
8.29.2008 9:22pm
The Ace (mail):
while building a grassroots political network is far more relevant executive experience than being mayor of a small town.

Laugh out loud funny.

Gee, I wonder why you didn't say Governor?

Thank you for demonstrating how good this selection was.


----------------

almost all of the enthusiasm for Palin on conservative sites is over her looks, not her competence or experience

Seriously, from an Obama voter!

Again, you can't parody you people any longer.
8.29.2008 9:23pm
The Ace (mail):
I love it,


Among the findings:

• Obama has not eased concerns about his depth of experience: 57% worry he lacks the experience to be an effective president, and 44% question whether he could handle the responsibilities of commander in chief.



Don't worry, wave your arms and shout "Palin"! I'm sure that will work.
8.29.2008 9:26pm
Christopher Cooke (mail):
I think it is too soon to say whether McCain's gamble on Palin will pay off for him. She could turn out to have been a brilliant pick for solidifying McCain's base with pro-life conservatives and for expanding the base into some of the blue collar women who were supporting Hillary strongly and were lukewarm about McCain and Obama. Or, she could turn into a Dan Quayle-type of pick: a negative impact but not a fatal one. It will really depend on how well she campaigns and debates.

I do think the "executive experience" argument is a joke.

I live in a town of 30,000, which is about 4 times larger than the town of which Ms. Palin was mayor. I live near a city that has more people than Alaska. I would not pick the mayor of either town to be VP because of their executive experience.
8.29.2008 9:28pm
The Ace (mail):
Zogby? Are you serious? Zogby. Wacka wacka. Where's the Uncle Fred's BBQ poll?

Why do you think you're typing such silly things?
Want to take a guess?
8.29.2008 9:31pm
metro_k_attys@yahoo.com (mail) (www):
The Dems are stuck. If they she lacks experience - there's no way around the fact that she has more experience than Obama.
8.29.2008 9:31pm
The Ace (mail):
Running a Presidential campaign with hundreds of staff and thousands of volunteers that defeated the Clinton machine in a 50 State contest, raising several hundred million dollars in the process while building a grassroots political network is far more relevant executive experience than being mayor of a small town

Is that why there are positions such as "campaign director" and "campaign manager" and "director of outreach" and such?

You are so deluded it is pathetic.
8.29.2008 9:32pm
A.S.:
I have trouble following David Post's everchanging objections to Governor Palin. First, he ran down Palin's resume (omitting, as Jonathan Adler notes, several important positions) and found it objectionable that McCain picked her while at the same time attacking Obama as "inexperienced". Now, however, David has abandoned his complaint that Palin is inexperienced - David now states that the number of years "doing this or that" isn't what he's talking about anyway. David, instead, completely changes his objection: now, David has a problem that he hasn't heard Palin's views on a laundry list of medium tier and low tier issues. Which, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with "experience" - if Palin had set up a blog a year ago and posted her views (in a way that satisfied David) on all these subjects that David is concerned about, her "experience" will not have changed one iota, and yet then, presumably, David would be then completely saitsfied with her. Right, David?

Despite David's complete shift in his objection to Palin, I think his objection has some worth. If it turns out that Palin has completely nutty views on a number of these issues, it will be a mistake to have chosen her. I doubt she does, but who knows. She has perfectly reasonable views on the subject that I do know she's commented about: energy, the environment, gay rights, Second Amendment, pork, governmental reform, etc. Moreover, I am curious whether David would ever support a Governor for President or VP. Most governors are not regularly asked their views on European Union integration or the effectiveness of international aid programs. So perhaps it is simply the case that David would just never support a Governor, and will only support Senators and Congressmen who have expressed views on these federal or international concerns. (Heck, I'd like to know how many of these subjects Obama had expressed a view on prior to his running for President.)
8.29.2008 9:34pm
The Ace (mail):
Uh, the change meme is change from Republican rule to something other than Republican rule.


Uh, yeah, not so much:

Rachel Robinson, widow of baseball player and African-American pioneer Jackie Robinson, said Obama is a "champion of social change."


In fact, Obama has been running as a "post partisan" candidate.
8.29.2008 9:35pm
metro_k_attys@yahoo.com (mail) (www):
Sarah Palin is the Governor of the largest State in the Union - larger than many countries - which State has an international border.

Sarah Palin was Mayor of the fastest growing town in Alaska.

Barack Obama has never held a single full-time job for more than three years.
8.29.2008 9:36pm
Dave N (mail):
Christopher Cooke,

Bill Clinton was the Governor of a state with approximately 2,000,000 when he ran for President (which I acknowledge is more than Alaska's 640,000). Did you, by any chance not support him because there are many American cities with a larger population than Arkansas?
8.29.2008 9:47pm
PC:
I'm actually interested in hearing Palin on the issues. She spoke well in her national introduction, and while I certainly don't agree with some of the things known about her (teaching creationism in school bad, lifelong NRA member good), she's being portrayed as a conservative/libertarian/reformer. Learning about her stances on national issues will be good.

One thing that concerns me about her initial introduction and some of the videos of her on YouTube is her "aww shucks" persona. We have some serious foreign policy issues to face, and while the hockey mom schtick plays well in Peoria, it's less useful on the international stage.

It's kind of a bizarre pick. I would have rather seen Kay Baily Hutchinson or Christie Todd Whitman as a VP pick for McCain. Both are much more qualified.

For the hyper-partisans on the right: Obama has been articulating his policy positions for over a year. You can go to his website and find a policy on just about anything you want. Hell, the other day I found a widget that would allow you to calculate how your taxes would change under McCain's vs. Obama's tax plan.

Saying you don't know what Obama believes after a year of 24/7 campaigning means you either don't care or you are just repeating talking points.
8.29.2008 9:51pm
PC:
Is that why there are positions such as "campaign director" and "campaign manager" and "director of outreach" and such?


Noted. The next time I judge the ability of corporate president I'll make sure he doesn't have a "VP of Finance," "VP of Marketing," or anyone else that he hires to help run the business.

Have you actually ever worked in a place where there is a hierarchical structure and the guy at the top delegates authority to others? But go ahead and pretend that Obama isn't managing an organization that has done something Republicans were never able to: defeat the Clinton political machine.
8.29.2008 10:01pm
The Ace (mail):
I'm looking forward to Michael Moore chasing Joe Biden around the Capitol/campaign trail asking him why his son, instead of being a greedy lobbyist, is not in Iraq, a war Biden supported, or in Afghanistan which Obama &Biden support?
That will be happening soon, right?

Right?
8.29.2008 10:04pm
The Ace (mail):
But go ahead and pretend that Obama isn't managing an organization that has done something Republicans were never able to: defeat the Clinton political machine


What I find comical is you actually believe this means something.

And again, Obama voters are talking about experience. You people can no longer be parodied.
8.29.2008 10:05pm
The Ace (mail):
Saying you don't know what Obama believes after a year of 24/7 campaigning means you either don't care or you are just repeating talking points.

Please then explain why Obama said the DC handgun ban (and Chicago's) was constitutional, then post Heller said the Supreme Court endorsed his view.

After you're done not doing then, tell us exactly how Obama feels about the 2nd Amendment.

Thanks.
8.29.2008 10:09pm
J Richardson:
I've read both of your posts and many of the responses.

Frankly, I think you are pissed off because she isn't a Yalie like you and isn't a lawyer. Get over yourself. She's done something you've never done - she has gotten elected to a statewide office. And she did it while raising a family and supporting her husband's fishing business. She lives in the real world and not the world of ethereal discussions of Internet law or Antonio Gramsci's theories on EuroCommunism.

Moreover, if I were in a gunfight, I'd rather have her defending my back than you. At least I know she is a straight shooter both figuratively and literally.
8.29.2008 10:09pm
Ak Mike (mail):
An additional point regarding Palin is that she sometimes appears unprepossessing, and is consistently underestimated. Many ridiculed her a few years ago when, with her only elective office having been mayor of Wasilla, she took on most experienced politicians in the state

Two years ago she faced a primary election against the sitting governor, Frank Murkowski, who had been elected to the US Senate four times before he was elected to the governorship, and who was supported by the state Republican Party - as well as another candidate who had strong support in the Interior of the state and with the business community. She creamed them both.

In the general election, she faced Tony Knowles, who is as good looking as her (although older), had been the very popular two-term mayor of Anchorage, and then had been a two-term governor. She creamed him.

Biden will be surprised
8.29.2008 10:11pm
The Ace (mail):
Two years ago she faced a primary election against the sitting governor,

It's funny, to the leftists posting here, this doesn't count.
Just that Obama "defeated the Clintons" and such.

Obama has never defeated an incumbent. Why?
He's never run against one.
8.29.2008 10:14pm
Waldo (mail):
Palin's a high risk pick. But McCain needs to take a risk. If, as Michael Feldman said in the WaPo:

The first rule in veep selection is do no harm. The second rule is that the only time you violate Rule No. 1 is when you think you have no choice.

McCain realizes that Rule No. 2 applies.

It's true that Palin doesn't have any experience to speak of in foreign policy or national issues. But while Obama has more, it's not by much. What may be more important, though, is Palin's experience in politics. Palin managed to defeat a sitting governor in a primary (a rare event, though McCaskill also pulled it off in MO) and then defeated a popular former governor in the general. If that doesn't give the Obama campaign pause, they're the ones who are out of touch.

Whether Palin turns out to be a smart pick for McCain will in the end depend on Palin. If she campaigns effectively and doesn't make any serious gaffes, McCain can win and his choice will be inspired. If she steps on it, McCain's pick will be remembered as desperate and stupid. It all depends on Palin. But, then again, that's what risk is all about.
8.29.2008 10:20pm
TDPerkins (mail):

and absolutely nothing suggests that Sarah Palin would be credible as President of the United States


No yardstick you can use for Palin is one in which Obama beats her alone, except measures against which McCain beats Obama.

And all that before you consider Obama's downsides.

Has executive experience:
Palin > Obama
Has senatorial experience:
McCain > Obama:
Not as far left:
McCain > Obama
Doesn't have an unrepentent terrorist for bestest friend EVUH!
McCain > Obama

Cluebat 2008 for Obama, "Ur doin' it wrong!"

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp
8.29.2008 10:21pm
Volokh Groupie:
Cool..so David Post outs himself as a kos level thinker who's an unabashed and illogical partisan

tell me something david--if you're worried about a Palin gaffe in the next two months are you equally as worried about Biden's 4 or 5 gaffes?

will you be on Biden's MBNA slush fund while Palin pretty much outed all of the corrupt legislators in alaska..even of her own party?

how do you reconcile Obama's lack of experience, the fact that he hasn't articulated clear opinions on many of your issues (the gulf war? the fed reserve bank? hahahaha) or the fact that he hasn't had as much executive experience as Palin.

Also, Palin has actually had some foreign policy experience...she part of the northern forum and has worked with numerous leaders http://www.northernforum.org/servlet/content/mission.html
8.29.2008 10:22pm
PC:
The Ace:
I'm looking forward to Michael Moore chasing Joe Biden around the Capitol/campaign trail asking him why his son, instead of being a greedy lobbyist, is not in Iraq, a war Biden supported, or in Afghanistan which Obama &Biden support?


Facts have a liberal bias.

What I find comical is you actually believe this means something.


It means that we won't be seeing Bush/Clinton/Bush/Clinton in the White House. The thing is, it doesn't matter if Obama has executive experience. If he did, then he would be a commie. Or a stealth Muslim. Or something else that would make him utterly unacceptable to you. There is no line Obama could cross that would mean he was fit to be president for you.

That's fine. You don't like his policies. But stop pretending it's about anything other than that. It's like concern trolling on meth.

After you're done not doing then, tell us exactly how Obama feels about the 2nd Amendment.


My guess is Obama is a gun grabbing Democrat (Biden certainly is), but he's smart enough to know that the Dems have lost that issue. There is no way the Democrats can compete in western states if they run on gun bans. Would Obama like to reenact the idiotic "Assualt Weapons Ban?" Probably. But even with Democratic control of Congress I doubt a President Obama would try it. The blowback in places like New Mexico, Colorado, Montana and Virginia would be huge on the state and national level.
8.29.2008 10:22pm
The Ace (mail):
Facts have a liberal bias.

Um, when did Michael Moore ask him about it?
When is the other son going again?
Both of McCain's are in the military.

That's fine. You don't like his policies. But stop pretending it's about anything other than that

Except I never said otherwise.
Nor did I imply it.
8.29.2008 10:28pm
The Ace (mail):
Facts have a liberal bias.

I love the fact you see fit to post a talking point.
Facts actually don't have a liberal, or any, bias at all.

Or, in the case of "facts" did you mean this?

I have done more than any other candidate in this race to take on lobbyists — and won.


Which is an out &out lie.
8.29.2008 10:30pm
The Ace (mail):
Facts have a liberal bias

No they don't.

But I find it hysterical leftists, the same people mocking Bush's TANG service, are puffing their chest's out about a JAG going to Iraq.

Too rich.
8.29.2008 10:33pm
The Ace (mail):
My guess is Obama is a gun grabbing Democrat

Why is there guessing involved?!
Obama has posted his potions and been running for a year 24/7, dammit!
8.29.2008 10:39pm
PC:
Except I never said otherwise.
Nor did I imply it.


Fair enough. Now, if you can contain yourself, do you think Gov. Palin is qualified to be the Vice President? If the unthinkable were to happen and President McCain were to pass, do you think Gov. Palin would be up for the job given the issues this nation faces (two wars, a bellicose Russia and Iran)?
8.29.2008 10:39pm
PC:
Why is there guessing involved?!
Obama has posted his potions and been running for a year 24/7, dammit!


I haven't looked at his policy positions on gun, but it's easy to assume that any Democrat from a major city is anti-gun. Gun control isn't a big issue at the moment because, luckily, the Republicans have won for now. The emergence and importance of western Democrats should temper the gun grabbing for a while.
8.29.2008 10:44pm
metro_k_attys@yahoo.com (mail) (www):
Barack Obama has zero executive experience.

Joe Biden has zero executive experience.

John McCain has military command experience.

Sarah Palin has executive experience as Governor of the largest state in the Union - and as Mayor of the fastest-growing town in Alaska. (Personally, I like small-town America).

On the experience issue, McCain and Palin win.

Besides, the "foreign policy experience" argument is non-serious. What was the "foreign policy experience" of Ronald Reagan, Franklin Roosevelt or Margaret Thatcher?

A great President is a great leader. Leadership skills are most clearly seen in people who have actually led: like McCain and Palin.

The "foreign policy experience" argument is actually a negative to me. I'd rather have someone with clear leadership skills as an American chief executive (like Governor Palin) - or military command experience (like McCain) - not someone who sat on some foreign affairs committee in Congress (like Biden).

Also - Palin's approval ratings in Alaska have consistently been over 80%! She's a leader. So is McCain. Obama and Biden are legislators - they've never held an executive or command position in their lives.

On experience McCain and Palin win.

Sarah Palin runs a State. Barack Obama runs his mouth. (And Obama's on the TOP of the ticket - sheez).
8.29.2008 10:46pm
PC:
btw, I don't know if Gov. Palin is qualified, that's why I'm interested to hear her speak on policy. There seem to have been more qualified candidates on the Republican VP short list, but maybe Gov. Palin brings something to the table than anyone else.
8.29.2008 10:46pm
Hoosier:
"The Ace:
AIDS policy

Gee, that's real complicated and all."


Yeah. I suspect she's against AIDS.

Next question.
8.29.2008 10:47pm
The Ace (mail):
Now, if you can contain yourself, do you think Gov. Palin is qualified to be the Vice President?

I don't see why not?
Nothing about her record indicates she has poor judgment and she is running a state bordering 2 countries.

"Qualified" is in the eye of the beholder I suppose.

I would argue all night that Biden is not qualified to president.
8.29.2008 10:51pm
Ak Mike (mail):
PC - the question isn't whether Palin would be "up for the job" - the question is whether she would be better at it than Obama. The answer to that question is yes.

Obama has no experience running anything other than a political campaign. Palin has just successfully completed a campaign of bringing in her gas pipeline proposal against the opposition of some of the largest oil companies in the world. (The proposed gas pipeline may be the largest civil construction project in history).
8.29.2008 10:51pm
The Ace (mail):

The "foreign policy experience" argument is actually a negative to me

I agree. The idea that Biden has some significant insights on foreign policy because he is on that committee is laughable.
8.29.2008 10:52pm
NRWO:
I'm with Post.

Frum, noting that McCain's campaign slogan is "country first", gets it right: "But question: If it were your decision, and you were putting your country first, would you put an untested small-town mayor a heartbeat away from the presidency?"

Palin is another Harriet Myers, except that, unlike Myers, Palin won't withdraw and won't be replaced.

The GOP is the part of principle. Palin was not a principled pick (Romney, e.g., would have been).
8.29.2008 10:52pm
Andrew J. Lazarus (mail):
OK, let's make it clear, that fast-growing town still has about 8000 inhabitants. That wasn't even a full-time position, was it? As I said before, there are student governments which need that level of executive leadership. Nor is it clear how good a job she did.

She does have about two years as governor of one of the least populous states, one whose economy based on resource extraction doesn't extrapolate to the rest of the country. That's not nothing, but there is no evidence so far that she knows anything about national or international issues.

It's somewhat tedious to read the "Ace" robopost little snippets of approved talking point snark. Can anyone doubt that if McCain had nominated Charles Manson, the Ace would be talking it up as a stroke of genius?
8.29.2008 10:56pm
Hoosier:
"Can anyone doubt that if McCain had nominated Charles Manson, the Ace would be talking it up as a stroke of genius?"

Yes. *I* doubt it. Manson was a *murderer.* That is very bad, you know.
8.29.2008 11:02pm
Volokh Groupie:
yeah NRWO...because people who have small town mayor in their qualifications are clearly disconnected with what this country is all about

they should be a harvard or yale educated lawyer or a millionare in order to know what this country is actually about
8.29.2008 11:02pm
Nifonged:
"I guess only Ivy Leaguers can ever be in the White House. "

Someone gets it.

If she was a liberal Dem, rather than a conservative GOP, who went to Brown or Dartmouth, rather than the University of Idaho, who was the governor of Vermont or NH, rather than Alaska, how much of this conversation would we be currently having?
8.29.2008 11:03pm
PC:
Palin is another Harriet Myers, except that, unlike Myers, Palin won't withdraw and won't be replaced.


I think it may be too early to say that. Miers had a long resume showing her experience and it was not SCOTUS worthy. On the upside, the nomination made picking out the blind partisans easy.

Gov. Palin is an unknown quantity at this point. We know about some of her conservative credentials, and she has apparently done some good things by cleaning up Alaskan corruption, but Prof. Post asks a valid question about her other views.
8.29.2008 11:08pm
PC:
If she was a liberal Dem, rather than a conservative GOP, who went to Brown or Dartmouth, rather than the University of Idaho, who was the governor of Vermont or NH, rather than Alaska, how much of this conversation would we be currently having?


I'm sure the word count would be similar, but the topic would be how the liberal Dem was really a commieislamofascist that hated the United States and wanted everyone to get gay married and have forced abortions right after Sharia law was enacted.
8.29.2008 11:12pm
Hoosier:
"Nifonged:
"I guess only Ivy Leaguers can ever be in the White House. "

Someone gets it.

If she was a liberal Dem, rather than a conservative GOP, who went to Brown or Dartmouth . . . "

OK. But *not* Cornell or Penn. I mean, we really *can* do better than that.
8.29.2008 11:13pm
Bpbatista (mail):
David Post and liberals bashing Palin -- you are all whistling past the graveyard. And it shows.
8.29.2008 11:17pm
Anderson (mail):
It's somewhat tedious to read the "Ace" robopost little snippets of approved talking point snark.

Hope he's getting paid for his efforts.
8.29.2008 11:21pm
Cornellian (mail):

OK. But *not* Cornell or Penn. I mean, we really *can* do better than that.


*gasp* how dare you!
8.29.2008 11:26pm
TCO:
She is a citizen. NOt a politician. Love it.
8.29.2008 11:32pm
NYU JD:
Another interesting contrast--for those who say that Obama has experience because he ran a great campaign? Contrast:

Obama on his subordinate's comments on Palin: "I think that, uh, you know campaigns start getting these uh, hair triggers and, uh, the statement that Joe and I put out reflects our sentiments," he said, according to the pool report, apparently criticizing his staff for going overboard, as he did occasionally in the primary."

Palin, meanwhile, had to actually take responsibility for her actions as governor, and when others pushed an investigation into that trooper non-scandal, she welcomed the investigation.

If Obama has "executive experience", it seems to be mostly directed at passing the buck and blaming subordinates.
8.29.2008 11:32pm
NRWO:
Groupie:

Is the GOP the party of principle?

Was Palin a principled choice, by your lights?

Could McCain have made a more principled choice (e.g., Romney) and still have been competitive in the election?

PC says, "I think it may be too early to say that." and "Gov. Palin is an unknown quantity at this point."

I agree, on both counts. But, it's generally not advisable to select "unknown quantities" when competitive known quantities are available. And, unknown quantities have not always worked out for the GOP. Palin could be another Souter (who is probably a better comparison than Myers); who knows?

There were plenty of known quantities in the GOP who would have been competitive.
8.29.2008 11:34pm
TJIT (mail):
David said
she will make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months
You mean gaffes like Barack "57 states" Obama has made?

Funny, Obama's gaffes did not seem to disturb his supporters or the media.
8.29.2008 11:35pm
TJIT (mail):
NRWO,

I think Palin is a better pick than Romney.

I really like the fact that she took on republican incumbents and beat them. Lots of old boy rot in the republican party and it is good to promote those who run the old boys out of office.

Furthermore, Palin was not picked in a vacuum. The other potential picks Romney, Huckabee, Lieberman, Giuliani all had substantial downsides.
8.29.2008 11:46pm
Saladman (mail):
Against a qualified Democratic ticket you might have a point, but you're ignoring how low Obama sets the bar. Palin is as or more experienced than Obama. I'll grant your point about the danger of McCain dropping dead early if you'll concede an Obama/Biden ticket runs the greater danger of Obama being too young and healthy to drop dead and make room for his experienced back up.

I think we need to disentangle qualification for the office from qualification for campaigning. I'll admit we don't know for sure how Palin will stand up on the national stage, but given your opinion of her, what's the problem with that? Its a self-correcting problem.

On qualification for the office: she has executive experience, she's taken on political corruption and pork-barrel earmarks, she's advanced natural gas pipelines and oil drilling.

What angers me are the implications of taking you seriously on being qualified for office. Apparently a candidate needs to play the DC-New York-Los Angeles media and social circuits. She needs to see and be seen. Executive experience in a western state, with half its land owned by the federal government, that has to maintain a healthy economy and tax base in the face of east coast dominated federal influence on land use and regulations doesn't qualify a person for high office. For that they need to play the DC game. Well, screw that.
8.29.2008 11:51pm
Nifonged:
"You mean gaffes like Barack "57 states" Obama has made?

Funny, Obama's gaffes did not seem to disturb his supporters or the media."

Bzzzing, there are some much better jabs on this thread. I think Obama is smart, but the guy has made more gaffes than most politicians would have survived had not they not been the chosen one by the media/political elite/intelligentsia.
8.29.2008 11:58pm
Bruce:
absolutely nothing suggests that Sarah Palin would be credible as President of the United States.

I think that was true about Truman also, and now he's everyone's favorite president. (He had horrible approval ratings at the time, though.)
8.30.2008 12:01am
Bruce:
P.S. I'm speaking against interest, here.
8.30.2008 12:02am
Jiffy:

You mean gaffes like Barack "57 states" Obama has made?


Is that really the best you can do? Look at the video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws). It's clear he slipped and said "57" when he meant "47." Compare that to a few of McCain's:

Iran is training Al-Qaeda

Surge allowed the Anbar Awakening to begin

Czechoslovakia
8.30.2008 12:07am
Smokey:
Justin:
How does having a six month disabled child show character?
Because plenty of folks on your side of the aisle would just kill the kid as soon as they found out -- rather than take on the responsibility. Where's the love?

See, that's the difference between character and expediency. Too bad you don't understand. But American voters might be a little more perceptive.
8.30.2008 12:07am
dgs (mail):
I agree with the Harriet Miers comments. I think it is depressing that relatively unqualified individuals like Obama and Palin are being considered for the nation's highest offices. I think it speaks volumes about our educational system in the U.S. and the generally decadent state of the country that these individuals are considered viable candidates.

When McCain's camp calls for a donation (I am still waiting even though i maxed out my contribution to him in the primaries and even though my wife gave $35 to Obama, and his people call our house every night .... another sign McCain has no chance), I will tell them that I need to save every penny to pay the new taxes I can expect when President Obama and the Democratic Congress swing into action.

Finally, my prediction is that within the next couple days as the criticisms continue, McCain and his surrogates will suggest that any critics of Palin are "sexists"--much like McCain's surrogates suggested that opponents of his immigration bill were "racists".

In sum, even though I probably agree with Palin on the issues, this is not a serious choice (but I could be proven wrong).
8.30.2008 12:11am
Dave N (mail):

It's clear he slipped and said "57" when he meant "47."
Which I MIGHT buy, except, you know, we have had 50 states Obama's entire lifetime.
8.30.2008 12:12am
Lib:
NYU JD:

Note that Obama's "decision to oppose the war" was irrelevant; he wasn't even a federal senator at the time, but a state senator with no responsibility for foreign policy whatsoever.

Also, Obama's decision was made without access to the (flawed) intelligence regarding WMDs which influenced those that actually had to take a relevant stand. Oddly, Obama picked a VP candidate who, with access to that intelligence, made the opposite judgment.

I believe Biden now asserts his Iraq war decision was a mistake. While I respect a person for admitting they were wrong about an important decision, it tends to decrease my confidence in that person's decision making capabilities and judgment. Hence, since Biden was brought onto the ticket to a large extent to shore up foreign policy weaknesses and he made a mistake on the single biggest issue on which the top of the ticket garnered the Democrat nomination, I'm not sure Palin's lack of experience seems so bad. At least, as far as I've heard so far, she doesn't have self admitted bad judgment about such an important issue.
8.30.2008 12:13am
TCO:
Reminds me of the VP in RAH Expanded Universe. Would love her to be Pres. We've had enough of the same old stuff. What's the harm of something more radical?

I remember all the kerfuffle and dislike for REagan's thuggishness from the Bushies and such in 79 and REagan was awasome. Won the Cold War and did a lot to reverse Careterism.

I was going to vote fore Barr (and I'm not a dopesmoker or a libertarian absolutist). But now will give REpubs serious look. Palin even reminds me of some of the things good about McCAin. Honest, brave, reformer, no earmarks. (I had forgotten them with my dislike of false conservative Bush...and thinking McCain even more liberal.)
8.30.2008 12:16am
David Warner:
The original post attempts a Harriet Miers redux. Pertinent differences:

1) VP is not a lifetime position, and the last relevant heartbeat was 45 years ago.

2) The Miers decision was revocable. McCain will not be revoking this one. This means more determined support for Palin.

3) Miers was the ultimate crony, Palin the ultimate anti-crony (ask the ones she's put in jail)

Finally, the idea behind the Miers pick - diversifying the professional qualification requirements for public office - was a sound one, and one in which the Founders would have been in sympathy. A significant aspect of Palin's strength is her non- and even anti-professional-political experience, and more important, accomplishments.
8.30.2008 12:16am
loki13 (mail):

It's somewhat tedious to read the "Ace" robopost little snippets of approved talking point snark.

Hope he's getting paid for his efforts.


I'm pretty sure "The Ace" is getting paid by the Democratic party.
8.30.2008 12:18am
lethal_ lou (mail):
Okay - let's get real. There are 50 people in the US who have the gumption and savvy to become a governor. Realistically - if you are posting on the forum you didn't make the cut for one reason or another. Sarah Palin did. She's got far more experience/education than 99% of the crowned heads of history had when they assumed the throne. As CEO of AK she's got lots of experience in fiscal management, personnel administration, sales/marketing, all the nuts/bolts of contemporary leadership. Foreign policy? Alaska is sandwiched between Russia and Canada - do you think she never dealt with foreign policy? Defense - she's commander in chief of the Alaskan National Guard - front line defense against Russian incursions. Her son's headed for Iraq in 13 days - presumably as a responsible mom she's taken advantage of her position to read herself in on the current situation. C'mon - get real here. She's the best choice for the job and I'm comfortable with her in either #1 or #2 position on the ticket. And candidly - every swinging richard in the US special ops community will back her above the alternative - without question. Nuff said?
8.30.2008 12:21am
MarkField (mail):

Yes. *I* doubt it. Manson was a *murderer.* That is very bad, you know.


OTOH, this IS the Ace we're talking about. Tough call.
8.30.2008 12:21am
neurodoc:
The Ace: "Obama is still a chickenhawk."

So we may put your comment in some perspective, would you please tell us when and where you served in any of the United States' military services.
8.30.2008 12:25am
TDPerkins (mail):

OTOH, this IS the Ace we're talking about. Tough call.


OTOH, we're talking about Obama too, and he really has Ayers for his good friend and buddy. If Ayers isn't a murderer, well--he regrets not doing more.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp
8.30.2008 12:29am
FlimFlamSam:
The ONLY important calculation in choosing a vice presidential nominee is the number of electoral votes that person will bring to the table. If Palin appeals to the more moderate, disaffected Hillary supporters, as she likely will, then she may put the ticket over the top in Ohio, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Colorado, more than securing a McCain victory.

It is not John McCain's fault that the Democrat primary season played out the way it did, and he would be foolish not to use this opportunity to appeal to women, many of whom are swing voters. Don't blame McCain for picking Palin; blame the voters--who are obsessed with identity politics--to whom it appeals.
8.30.2008 12:29am
Syd Henderson:
Dave N (mail):


It's clear he slipped and said "57" when he meant "47."

Which I MIGHT buy, except, you know, we have had 50 states Obama's entire lifetime.
8.29.2008 11:12pm

Except he hadn't campaigned in all 50 of them.
8.30.2008 12:38am
Smokey:
Dave N:
Christopher Cooke,

Bill Clinton was the Governor of a state with approximately 2,000,000 when he ran for President (which I acknowledge is more than Alaska's 640,000). Did you, by any chance not support him because there are many American cities with a larger population than Arkansas?
[I note for the record that Christopher Cooke is hiding out.]

NRWO:
...would you put an untested small-town mayor a heartbeat away from the presidency?"
Please explain to us, NRWO, why you deliberately omitted "Governor" from your comment? Make it a real good explanation, this is a public forum. Your credibility is at stake.

PC:
Gov. Palin is an unknown quantity at this point.
ORLY? Palin's record is a secret, huh?

Conclusion: the desperate 'Rat cheerleaders are grasping at straws. Palin is a strong, ethical, experienced woman, and Ace is making this thread look like a WWF Smackdown.
8.30.2008 12:38am
PC:
Don't blame McCain for picking Palin; blame the voters--who are obsessed with identity politics--to whom it appeals.


That's nonsense. If McCain is playing to identity politics it's his own choice. There is a large field of qualified candidates that could have filled the VP slot for McCain and he chose Gov. Palin. Hopefully McCain made the choice for a better reason than identity politics. Otherwise we have a person who is pandering to the populace because getting elected is more important than standing on principal.

Oh, right. This is politics.
8.30.2008 12:38am
TJIT (mail):
The Ace,

The chickenhawk slur is a loathsome one. Using it does not do your position any good.
8.30.2008 12:40am
Psalm91 (mail):
"Constantin 5:54--the only ones who don't know Obama's tax policy by now are the ones who are willfully ignorant.

I guess that includes the Associated Press, as of this morning:

"He said he would 'cut taxes for 95 percent of all working families,' but did not say how.""

You are aware that Ron Fournier (AP editor) works for Karl Rove?

It will take a few days for the Palin information to come out. For those of you who are actually practicing litigators, the conventions are the opening statements. You have heard the plaintiff's and you will hear the defendant's next week. Then the real trial starts, culminating with the verdict in November. We non-R's can hope that Von Spakovsky does not have access to the sequestered jury, but he was hired for a reason.
8.30.2008 12:41am
PC:
ORLY? Palin's record is a secret, huh?


YARLY! Gov. Palin has no national or international experience. If she has any statements on policy outside of Alaska, please point me to them. McCain has been in the Senate for 20 years, so we know his positions. Obama has been campaigning for president for the last 3-47 years (depending on the source) so we have a pretty good idea on what his positions are. Biden has been in the Senate for 30 years, so we know his positions too (feh).

Gov. Palin? A vague idea. She has strong social conservative credentials, she's fought corruption, and she has apparently stood up to some large oil companies. Outside of that I have no idea where she stands on international issues, or anything outside of Alaska.

Again, if you have anything that would help fill in Gov. Palin's views, I'd would love to see it.
8.30.2008 12:51am
Jon Roland (mail) (www):
This from another forum:

From: MB Libertarian7 mblibertarian7@earthlink.net
To: AMOJ_MAIN@yahoogroups.com

I was just on im with someone who knows Palin personally. He finds her extremely ethical and down to earth. She closed the governor's mansion and continues to live in her own home. Fired the royal chef and continues to do her family's meals. She had great things to say about Ron Paul. She may be too full of ethics to hang around McCain long.

Mike

Please visit my website
Michael Benoit
Candidate
California's 52nd Congressional District
http://www.benoit08.com
8.30.2008 12:54am
LoafingOaf (mail):


and I'd happily put money on the following: she will make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months.



Well, gee! And I'd happily put money on the following: Obama, McCain, and Biden will all make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months, as well.



Plus, I don't care how carefully vetted she's been by the McCain campaign -- I think it's close to even money that 10,000 reporters and bloggers who will now descend upon Alaska (at least virtually) will find something less than savory.


We already have less than savory stuff exposed on Obama, McCain, and Biden. The only person on either ticket for whom nothing unsavory has come out is Palin.

The Palin choice won my vote for McCain. I've been googling ger since her name first got thrown around and she's clearly a very good and competant woman. I can't wait to vote for her. Thank God McCain was smart enough not to go with that smarmy plastic man who strapped a dog on the roof of his car.
8.30.2008 12:56am
trad and anon:
Sarah Palin was Mayor of the fastest growing town in Alaska.

When you're talking about a tiny base, fast growth (in percentage terms) is the consequence of just about any growth. Wallasia could have doubled in size with a population increase that Cleveland or Detroit (which, incidentally, are larger than the entire state of Alaska) wouldn't even notice.
8.30.2008 12:56am
rarango (mail):
It doesnt amount to a warm bucket of piss what a bunch of us commenters think--the voters will decide--and Palin trumps of all our bleatings and analyses--this lady is going to be plus--and if you dont think her bio and life experience will resonate with americans you only display your own sequestered view of reality. Time will tell. I am looking for a large 5 to 7 point bounce for McCain. we'll see--I mean really: who gives a shit what a bunch of friggin lawyers think. Hint: it isnt the american public. YOur mileage may vary of course, but it says more about you that it does about the voters.
8.30.2008 1:08am
LoafingOaf (mail):

Wallasia could have doubled in size with a population increase that Cleveland or Detroit (which, incidentally, are larger than the entire state of Alaska) wouldn't even notice.


If Cleveland had one single more person living here (my hometown) than last year (instead of the extreme population decreases year after year), that would be headline news in Cleveland.

I'm still thinking about the blogger believing he made some big prediction that Palin will make a gaffe before November. Perhaps he places a bit too much importance on gaffes. If we reincarnated Thomas Jefferson and ran him in this election, Jefferson would make a gaffe too. The blogger is a bit too afraid of an outsider as a VP candidate. McCain needed to pick an exciting running mate and he did. Thank God the blogger doesn't run the McCain campaign or McCain would have already lost.
8.30.2008 1:14am
Randy R. (mail):
Let's see: I guess McCain is saying that there is not a single male who is more qualified as VP than Palin or else he would have of course choosen him.

Let's face it folks -- Palin was choosen simply because she's a gal, no more, no less. And I thought the Republicans were against affirmative action!

And it appears that McCain hardly knew her until she came down to one of his 12 or so ranches and had a few drinks with her, liked her, and asked her for the job. Sheesh, I know clerks who get vetted better than this!
8.30.2008 1:23am
Randy R. (mail):
And heck she does have lots of experience. Why, she was a sportscaster for a local tv news show! AND, she was fourth runner up in the Miss Alaska Beauty Pageant.

These are exactly the qualifications I need in a person who might have her hand on the button.
8.30.2008 1:25am
loki13 (mail):

Bill Clinton was the Governor of a state with approximately 2,000,000 when he ran for President (which I acknowledge is more than Alaska's 640,000). Did you, by any chance not support him because there are many American cities with a larger population than Arkansas?


Just for reference (not that it really matters)

Four U.S. cities have a population greater than 2 million:

Houston, Chicago, LA, and NY.

Alaska has 680k people. There are 16 cities with more population, including Austin, Columbus, and Jacksonville (one of those cities even hosted a SUper Bowl!).

Alaska does, however, beat out Wyoming in population, considered the current home of VP Cheney (if he is considered to have a home other than DC, an "undisclosed loaction", or a Lake of Fire in Mordor).

In 1990 (the year I have data), Arkansas had 2.35 million people. This takes Houston out, leaving three cities.

Just to let Smokey know.
8.30.2008 1:25am
LoafingOaf (mail):

Let's face it folks -- Palin was choosen simply because she's a gal, no more, no less. And I thought the Republicans were against affirmative action!

And it appears that McCain hardly knew her until she came down to one of his 12 or so ranches and had a few drinks with her, liked her, and asked her for the job. Sheesh, I know clerks who get vetted better than this!



Complete rubbish. Palin was the dream running mate choice for a large percentage of McCain voters for months now. It's just that few thought he'd have the guts to pick her. Now that he has, the excitement is rampant. He made the right choice. It's still gonna be tough to beat Obama, but McCain's running mate will mobilize the base.

Your second paragraph is just too silly to respond to.
8.30.2008 1:29am
Randy R. (mail):
It's really funny seeing everyone here defent Palin and insist that she is highly qualified. They compare her to Obama. Should you be comparing her to Biden? After all, they are both in the exact same positions, angling for the same position in the White House.

On that bout, Biden is the clear winner when it comes to experience. But I'm sure some hack will state that being a Beauty pageant also-ran is sooooo much more demanding than being a US senator.
8.30.2008 1:30am
dgs (mail):
Hmmm..... "hand on the button".....


former "community organizer" and devotee of the Reverand Jeremiah "the government gave us AIDS" Wright

v.

former beauty contestant runner up and sportscaster


decisions, decisions.....
8.30.2008 1:34am
PC:
Really, no one singing the praises of Gov. Palin has anything of substance to put out there? I found an article that is very flattering. This is a person that may be playing second fiddle to the most powerful man in the world. At some point she may have to stare down foreign politicians that have been playing this game for decades.

links plox
8.30.2008 1:39am
LoafingOaf (mail):
Besides the fact that Palin is clearly a good, smart, competent candidate who hasn't been corrupted by Washington, Palin simultaneously does two things: She both modbilizes the GOP base AND attracts swing voters.

The two keys to the election are getting your base to the polls on election day and winning over swing voters.

Palin was the perfect choice because she does both.

The person who said she is not experienced enough to have her "finger on the button," the fact is that no one in earth is qualified to have their "finger on the button." But Palin never will have her finger literally on the button. What she will do is surround herself with very good people, as she has demonstrated in Alaska.

Meanwhile, Obama and Biden were against the surge in Iraq. Biden even wanted to partition Iraq in defiance of the will of the Iraqi people. But how do you figure out Biden, who was against the Gulf War but for the Iraq liberation but then against finishing the Iraq liberation but then for a policy that would make us even more involved in Iraq, etc etc etc.
8.30.2008 1:40am
Metro Contract Attorneys (mail) (www):
Palin's a true-blue conservative. She helps the GOP ticket immeasurably.

Since when did the Volokh Conspiracy contributors - and many commenters - become a bunch of pointed-headed liberals?

Best blog post on Palin:

Rachel Lucas on Governor Sarah Palin
8.30.2008 1:43am
LoafingOaf (mail):
Obama didn't even have the judgment to leave a church where the pimp int he pulpit was claiming that whitey spread AIDS.

Palin is more fit for the presidency than the Democrats' top-of-the-ticket candidate.
8.30.2008 1:44am
Jane (mail):
The is a greater chance than not the McCain will live for at least 4 more years (its in his genes - reference his mother) making Palin's limited experience less relevant.

So he could have picked a more qualified, but not so electable VP choice, but exactly how would that have helped him, or America for that matter. (Given that - IMHO - the USA is better of with Mr. Moderate Maverick McCain than Mr. Collective Socialist Obama.)
8.30.2008 1:57am
ponraul:
I don't think that you have the resume to be allowed to call this decision "stupid." Do tell, why then is Obama qualified to be president?

Oh, and I don't quite understand why you never bother to even address the obvious counter points to your arguments. If you are going to take a strong stance, you should at least be ready to back it. The people who read this blog expect at least this.

Overall, you don't post all that often, and when you do you fail to add any value.
8.30.2008 2:13am
ponraul:
Oh, and I fail to see how this post is in any way more thoughtful than the last. Please explain.

It is very sad with a Volokh Conspirator has less of an ability to back up his positions than the average law student at xoxohth.com
8.30.2008 2:16am
Christopher Cooke (mail):
Smokey: I have not been hiding, I just have a life away from this blog.

I am not criticizing this pick, it is too soon to tell whether Palin is a good choice or a mistake. I stand by my comment that 16 months executive experience running a state with a small population hardly qualifies her over anyone else in the race (McCain, Obama, Biden). Her state is small potatoes and she has not run it very long.

But, she may have an appealing personality that clicks with voters, and certainly defeating experienced and connected politicians (as she did) suggests she has some talent as a campaigner.
8.30.2008 2:46am
Stwren (mail):
Wow, it seems like McCain is throwing the election. Well, maverick to the end I guess, but weird way to go out.
8.30.2008 3:11am
Ohio Scrivener (mail):
David,

Your claim that the pick of Sarah Palin is "stupid" is not exactly a shining example of good advocacy. You argue that Palin is "probably" a "stupid" selection because she might "make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months." Is that really the standard you want for a "stupid" VP selection? What are you going to say when Biden makes a gaffe? (It's not like Biden hasn't had a long history of that kind of folly). Will Biden then be a "stupid" VP selection too?

Your other rationale for the pick being "stupid" already applies to Biden. You claim that " it's close to even money that 10,000 reporters and bloggers who will now descend upon Alaska (at least virtually) will find something less than savory. " Yet, since Biden's announcement as a VP candidate, something unsavory has already been uncovered about Biden as it relates to payments received by his lobbyist son, Hunter:

"From 2001 to 2005, Hunter was paid an undisclosed amount by the credit card giant, which has since been purchased by Bank of America. It has been widely reported that he received $100,000 a year.

At the time, Sen. Biden led a successful, high-profile battle in the Senate for a bankruptcy bill that ultimately benefited credit card companies. The law makes it more difficult for people to file for personal bankruptcy protection under Chapter 7."



Again, applying your logic, does this new unsavory fact now make Biden a "stupid" VP selection too?

I don't have a crystal ball to predict how Palin will handle herself during the campaign. She made a good first impression (so much so that the left is starting to look unhinged in its criticisms of her). She may turn out to be an excellent pick. If not, I'll be glad to acknowledge the facts to the contrary based upon her performance not the wishful thinking of her opponents.
8.30.2008 3:21am
LM (mail):
Pete Freans:

And we are to trust a man who spent a total of 143 working days in the U.S. Senate before announcing his candidacy for president with arguably the most powerful political seat in the world?

Railroad Gin:

If anything, Obama has less experience.

Trevor Taylor:

Two years as governor plus time served as Mayor is more executive experience than Obama has, so if she's not qualified what does that make him?

A.W.:

Sheesh, the woman has more executive branch experience than McCain, Obama, and Biden combined...

If she isn't ready to be president, none of them are. Especially not Obama.

YYY:

Palin has been both a mayor and a governor. She is more quailfied for leadership as POTUS, even as a VP, then Obamanation.

metro_k_attys@yahoo.com:

The Dems are stuck. If they [say] she lacks experience - there's no way around the fact that she has more experience than Obama.


Ak Mike:

Obama has no experience running anything other than a political campaign. Palin has just successfully completed a campaign of bringing in her gas pipeline proposal against the opposition of some of the largest oil companies in the world.

Saladman:

Palin is as or more experienced than Obama.

No one who's not a Republican partisan is going to take the argument that she has more relevant background experience than Obama seriously.

Those aren't my words. They're another leftist's.
8.30.2008 4:16am
Math_Mage (mail) (www):
It's probably stupid because it will gain McCain little and may lose him a great deal. Nobody can possibly know, at this point, how she will perform on the stage she is about to enter onto -- debates with 100 million viewers, a daily crush of reporters, speech after speech after speech, where one bad gaffe puts you in the dustbin of history forever. It's unspeakable pressure, she's never faced anything like it, and I'd happily put money on the following: she will make at least one serious gaffe over the next two months.


She defeated both the Republican incumbent and the Democratic opponent in her election to the position of governor. That's more campaign experience than Obama, who made the state legislature when all his opponents were disqualified on a technicality and made Congress because the Republicans ran Alan Keyes, of all people, against him. As for gaffes, I don't think she can top Biden calling Obama a "clean, articulate" black man like "something out of a storybook."

Plus, I don't care how carefully vetted she's been by the McCain campaign -- I think it's close to even money that 10,000 reporters and bloggers who will now descend upon Alaska (at least virtually) will find something less than savory.


Worst that's happened so far is that she MAY have overstepped her bounds in pressuring the Public Safety Commissioner to fire her sister's ex from his police position. The guy isn't exactly a class act, either, full story here:
http://www.adn.com/news/politics/story/510080.html

People at TPM compare THIS to "Bridge to Nowhere" Ted Stevens' scandals. Hilarious.

It's a bad choice because John McCain is 71 years old, and his vice president will have a non-trivial chance of becoming president, and absolutely nothing suggests that Sarah Palin would be credible as President of the United States. I do NOT think this is just a matter of adding up the number of years spent doing this or doing that. Sarah Palin has been in public life, basically, for two years. to my knowledge, she has never articulated (because she was never called upon to articulate) any views whatsoever on:

list of positions here.


How many VPs were former state governors? How many Presidents? As long as McCain doesn't kick the bucket on day 1, Palin will have time to develop those positions. And her situation's certainly better than someone who articulates his positions without any record to back them up (now, who could I be talking about here?). No, I'm not worried about the small probability that McCain dies in office. After all, look the other way - if Obama's elected, it's 100% certain that there will be a President with no experience or SUPPORTED positions in office.
8.30.2008 4:46am
LM (mail):
Hoosier:

"Can anyone doubt that if McCain had nominated Charles Manson, the Ace would be talking it up as a stroke of genius?"

Yes. *I* doubt it. Manson was a *murderer.* That is very bad, you know.

What Mark Field said. And since TDPerkins already validated what I was going to predict, I'll just add two more things about the Palin selection as it relates to you personally:

1. If there's only one true religion, this pretty much settles what it is, since God obviously hears the prayers of Roman Catholics.

2. I haven't yet figured out why, but I think you owe everyone on this site, from The Ace to Revonna LaSchatze, a drink.
8.30.2008 4:54am
Federal Dog:
One thing's for sure: She really brings out the offensive, arrogant, and dismissive condescension of Obama supporters. There's a reason they are reacting in such a truly over-the-top way.

Let the woman speak, and inform yourselves about her, then evaluate her.
8.30.2008 8:47am
The Ace (mail):
It's somewhat tedious to read the "Ace" robopost little snippets of approved talking point snark.

Um, you can't point to a single post I've made where that has happened.

Go ahead clown, I dare you to.
8.30.2008 8:50am
The Ace (mail):
The Ace,

The chickenhawk slur is a loathsome one. Using it does not do your position any good.


That doesn't change the fact that Obama is a chickenhawk.

Where were you when the left called Bush this "slur" endlessly?
8.30.2008 8:52am
The Ace (mail):
Compare that to a few of McCain's:

Iran is training Al-Qaeda


Um, they are.

This is a fact not in dispute.


During a hearing at Senate Armed Services Committee today, the commander of US forces in Iran, General David Petreaus, accused Iran of "funding, training, arming and directing" the Shia extremist groups in Iraq. Gen. Petreaus also said that the Iraqi leaders are now recognizing the threat posed by Iran.

The US military had in the past accused Iran of funding, training and arming Shia militias in Iraq. What was new in Peteaus testimony today was the assertion that Iran is also "directing" the so-called special groups' actions in Iraq.


Let me guess clown, you know more about it than him, right?
8.30.2008 8:56am
The Ace (mail):
I'm pretty sure "The Ace" is getting paid by the Democratic party.

Aw, isn't that cute loopy?!
Why don't you post another link proving a point I made.

Egg on your face much?
8.30.2008 8:58am
The Ace (mail):
So we may put your comment in some perspective, would you please tell us when and where you served in any of the United States' military services.

Laugh out loud funny.

You did this to all the leftists calling Bush a chickenhawk, right?

That is now the standard, correct?

As a matter of fact I'm guessing I was at Fort Ord when you were in grade school, clown.
8.30.2008 9:00am
LM (mail):
Ace,

During a hearing at Senate Armed Services Committee today, the commander of US forces in Iran, General David Petreaus, accused Iran of "funding, training, arming and directing" the Shia extremist groups in Iraq.

Al-Qaeda are Sunni, not Shia. Not only is that text you quoted not evidence that Iran is training Al-Qaeda, its negative implication is that Iran is not training Al-Qaeda. So you talked a bunch of smack, and the only target you hit was you.

Ace, we all make mistakes, but if you'd be a little less of a jerk about it, you wouldn't have to look so foolish when it's pointed out.
8.30.2008 9:52am
scipio_79:
Why Prof. Post and the like praise Obama and not Palin even though Palin has more relevant experience: Obama went to Columbia and Harvard, Palin went to Univ. of Idaho. Prof. Post, go back to your Ivory Tower.
8.30.2008 9:55am
dcpi (mail):
The top three reasons Palin is a good VP pick:

1: She is not a trained lawyer (finally!)

2: She never attended a Harvard/Yale game

3. She was mentored by her neighbors, not the party elite.

From there we could go on. Neither Obama nor Palin have experience, but the more Obama punches that point the more stuck he becomes.
8.30.2008 11:20am
MarkField (mail):

OTOH, we're talking about Obama too, and he really has Ayers for his good friend and buddy. If Ayers isn't a murderer, well--he regrets not doing more.


Gotta admire the Dadaist segue.
8.30.2008 11:24am
TDPerkins (mail):
LM, don't complain or rejoice about it until you can show how it isn't true.

YOurs, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp
8.30.2008 11:40am
Truthiness:
All nonsense aside, the TRUTH is simpe:

Palin = Worse than Dan Quayle

Palin = Harriet Miers.

Women will not be duped by John McCain's transparent and cynical ploy. This VP choice is a disaster, and a mortal, self-inflicted wound to McCain's presidential campaign.

The presidential race is OVAH, folks.
8.30.2008 11:44am
LM (mail):
TDPerkins:

LM, don't complain or rejoice about it until you can show how it isn't true.

I'm not aware I did either, but that's neither here nor there. To be clear, the "it" you're referring to is your comment [in bold] at the end of this dialog:

"Can anyone doubt that if McCain had nominated Charles Manson, the Ace would be talking it up as a stroke of genius?"

Yes. *I* doubt it. Manson was a *murderer.* That is very bad, you know.

OTOH, this IS the Ace we're talking about. Tough call.

OTOH, we're talking about Obama too, and he really has Ayers for his good friend and buddy. If Ayers isn't a murderer, well—he regrets not doing more.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp


... and you want me to show how that isn't true? With apologies to Mark, you might as well ask me to falsify Sun Ra. I'm not even sure it's safe to look at that comment without a turtle neck and bongos.

Seriously though, if you'll explain what you're trying to say and how it follows from what preceded, I'll try to give you a more substantive answer.
8.30.2008 1:07pm
Andrew J. Lazarus (mail):
David Bernstein does even better in his comment thread than in his original post.
1.5 years running Alaska, whose legislature meets 90 days a year, and which has oil money coming out of its ears, versus 1.5 years running a nine-figure presidential campaign with what appears to be an absolute minimum of friction and infighting, being questioned about every possible national and international issue under the sun, being advised by the brightest lights of the Democratic Party, being exposed to unrelenting (if often adulatory) media attention, and under attack from the nation's strongest political dynasty. It's not even close.
Palin was selected to make McCain a better candidate, not a better President. Unlike, say, Gov. Schwarzenegger, there is not a shred of evidence that she's ever thought about major national or international issues (excepting a very oil-centric view of energy policy).

McCain is banking on enough voters forgetting that Legally Blonde is make-believe. People who look unqualified generally are.

Aside to Ace: I generally don't pay attention to anything pseudonymous posters claim about their life history, e.g., military experience. Might be true, might not. Just saying.
8.30.2008 2:09pm
TDPerkins (mail):
LM, you were making an attempt at a snarky comment about The Ace supposedly being willing to support McCain's VP pick even if McCain picked a murderer. I'm merely throwing it in your face that your Presidential candidate IS buddy-buddy with an unrepentant terrorist.

One who regrets only that he wasn't a more successful murderer than he was.

So when you and Andrew were trying out your Manson snark-fu, you were really projecting.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp
8.30.2008 2:14pm
Neil (mail) (www):
Just to add another data point to the "Palin" experience measure: Sarah Palin manages a state government budget nearly twice as large as Bill Clinton ever did.

In 2007 Alaska had total state government expenditures of over $5.5 billion dollars in 2007, making it the 32nd largest state government in the US.

In 1991, when Bill Clinton was governor, Arkansas was the 37th largest state government, having spent $1.86 billion dollars. This is $2.79 billion in 2007 dollars.

See this post on my blog for links to sources.
8.30.2008 2:54pm
Federal Dog:
"The presidential race is OVAH, folks."

That may well be true, just not in the way that you are hoping.
8.30.2008 3:18pm
metro1 (mail) (www):
When it comes to experience - there are negative types of experience.

For example - Joe Biden has lots of experience plagiarizing others - he did it in law school and in 1987 during his Presidential campaign.

Obama has lots of experience hob-nobbing in Chicago high society with admitted domestic terrorist Bill Ayers.

"Experience" is an argument where the Dems have nothing but bad news: a partial-term Senator from Illinois and a serial plagiarist. Great experience.

As usual, Mark Steyn has it right:

Mark Steyn's take on Governor Sarah Palin:

* * *

What other country in the developed world produces beauty queens who hunt caribou and serve up a terrific moose stew? As an immigrant, I'm not saying I came to the United States purely to meet chicks like that, but it was certainly high on my list of priorities. And for the gun-totin' Miss Wasilla then to go on to become Governor while having five kids makes it an even more uniquely American story. Next to her resume, a guy who's done nothing but serve in the phony-baloney job of "community organizer" and write multiple autobiographies looks like just another creepily self-absorbed lifelong member of the full-time political class that infests every advanced democracy.

* * *

Sarah Palin and Barack Obama are more or less the same age, but Governor Palin has run a state and a town and a commercial fishing operation, whereas (to reprise a famous line on the Rev Jackson) Senator Obama ain't run nothin' but his mouth. She's done the stuff he's merely a poseur about. Post-partisan? She took on her own party's corrupt political culture directly while Obama was sucking up to Wright and Ayers and being just another get-along Chicago machine pol (see his campaign's thuggish attempt to throttle Stanley Kurtz and Milt Rosenberg on WGN the other night).

* * *

Exactly right.

See, also, Rachel Lucas' take on Governor Sarah Palin
8.30.2008 3:55pm
Andrew J. Lazarus (mail):
I would describe Mark Steyn as a member of the effete macho-wannabe class that infests the conservative movement of this democracy.
8.30.2008 4:07pm
MarkField (mail):

LM, you were making an attempt at a snarky comment about The Ace supposedly being willing to support McCain's VP pick even if McCain picked a murderer.


That was me making the snarky comment, not LM.
8.30.2008 4:07pm
TDPerkins (mail):
MarkField, LM was picking it up.

Yours, TDP, ml, msl, &pfpp
8.30.2008 4:29pm
TJIT (mail):
The Ace said,
Where were you when the left called Bush this "slur" endlessly?
Not necessary, folks making that argument look like ill mannered, uninformed, idiots.

Might be wise to avoid putting yourself in that kind of company.

Chickenhawks, revisited revisited (NOW WITH MORE LINKED IDIOCY!)

I will accept as valid the chickenhawk argument from any person who agrees to support a Constitutional Amendment making military service a prerequisite for all who presume to shape foreign policy, up to and including the President, members of both the House and Senate, and all Federal Court justices. Either that, or from those who push to pass a Constitutional Amendment disbanding the military, which makes the question moot.

Short of that, I'd ask you to save your anti-democratic impulses for, say, campus speech codes or social engineering programs driven by the idea of proportionality—and allow the grownups to make the difficult choices that arise in the course of protecting the interests of our nation.
8.30.2008 10:34pm
TJIT (mail):
Randy R. you said
It's really funny seeing everyone here defent Palin and insist that she is highly qualified. They compare her to Obama. Should you be comparing her to Biden? After all, they are both in the exact same positions, angling for the same position in the White House.
Randy I don't think pointing out that the republican Vice Presidential candidate (Palin)has more experience than the democratic presidential candidate (Obama) is going to help your cause.
8.30.2008 10:42pm
LM (mail):
TDPerkins:

LM, you were making an attempt at a snarky comment about The Ace supposedly being willing to support McCain's VP pick even if McCain picked a murderer.

I endorsed Andrew's and Mark's well-deserved snark about Ace's over-the-top behavior. The only thing McCain and a hypothetical murderer had to do with it was rhetorical. Were you under the impression we were running electoral map scenarios for a McCain-Murderer ticket?

I'm merely throwing it in your face that your Presidential candidate IS buddy-buddy with an unrepentant terrorist.

Putting aside the ever-popular topic of Obama's alleged buddies, what you're throwing in my face is an overly literal, humorless analogy to a rhetorical joke. I don't mind that you did it (like I said, I assumed somebody would), but if you're going to free associate from some playful banter to The Evil That Is Barack Obama, just don't expect me to come along for the ride.

So when you and Andrew were trying out your Manson snark-fu, you were really projecting.

It wasn't your best effort. You'll have better days.
8.31.2008 3:07am